Miscellanies 8.4.12

Summary: The questioner must say whether “what is in the womb” means the seed or the formed embryo; otherwise his question is as ambiguous as asking whether “the dog” is an animal.

Textual problem in this passage: the printed text is uncertain or disputed here. See the notes.

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Greek text · Stählin 2

εἰ δὲ διακόπτειν ἐπιχειροίη τὴν ἐξέτασιν πυνθανόμενος, δῆλός ἐστιν οὐδὲ ἀκούειν βουλόμενος. Ἀλλʼ εἰ μὲν ἀποκρίνεσθαι ἕλοιτο, πάντων πρῶτον ἐρωτητέον αὐτὸν ἐφʼ ὅ τι φέρει πρᾶγμα τὸ ζῷον ὄνομα, κἀπειδὰν τοῦτο ἀποκρίνηται, πάλιν ἐρωτητέον ὅ τι ποτὲ αὐτῷ σημαίνει τὸ κυούμενον ἢ τὸ κατὰ γαστρός, εἰ τὰ μὴ διαπεπλασμένα ἤδη [καὶ τὰ ζῷα] καὶ τὸ σπέρμα αὐτὸ τὸ καταβεβλημένον τὸ κατὰ γαστρὸς αὐτῷ σημαίνειν βούλεται ἢ μόνα τὰ διηρθρωμένα τε καὶ ἤδη διαπεπλασμένα, τὰ ἔμβρυα καλούμενα. ἀποκριναμένου δὲ καὶ πρὸς τοῦτο περαίνειν ἤδη τὸ προκείμενον ἐφεξῆς καὶ διδάσκειν χρή. Εἰ δὲ ἡμᾶς λέγειν βούλοιτο αὐτὸς μὴ ἀποκρινάμενος, ἀκουσάτω· ἐπεὶ σὺ μὴ βούλει λέγειν καθʼ ὅτου σημαινομένου λέγεις ὃ προὔβαλες (οὕτω γὰρ ἂν οὐ περὶ σημαινομένων ἐγὼ ἐποιούμην τὸν λόγον, ἀλλʼ ὑπὲρ αὐτῶν ἤδη τῶν πραγμάτων ἐσκοπούμην), γίνωσκε τοιοῦτόν τι ποιήσας οἷον εἰ καὶ προὔβαλες εἰ ζῷον ὁ κύων. εἰκότως γὰρ ἂν εἴποιμι· ποίου κυνός; ἐγὼ γὰρ καὶ περὶ τοῦ χερσαίου καὶ τοῦ θαλαττίου καὶ τοῦ κατʼ οὐρανὸν ἄστρου, ἀλλὰ καὶ Διογένους καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ἐφεξῆς δίειμι κυνῶν. οὐ γὰρ ἂν μαντευσαίμην πότερον ὑπὲρ πάντων ἐρωτᾷς ἢ τινός. ὅπερ οὖν ἐξ ὑστέρου ποιήσεις, τοῦτʼ ἤδη μαθεῖν περὶ ποίου ζητεῖς, σαφῶς εἰπέ. εἰ δὲ περὶ ὀνόματα στρέφῃ, τὸ κυούμενον αὐτὸ δὴ τοῦτο τοὔνομα παντὶ δῆλον ὅτι μήτε ζῷόν ἐστι μήτε φυτόν, ἀλλʼ ὄνομά τε καὶ φωνὴ καὶ σῶμα καὶ ὂν καὶ τὶ καὶ πάντα μᾶλλον ἢ ζῷον. καὶ εἴπερ τοῦτο προὔβαλες, ἔχεις τὴν ἀπόκρισιν.

English · Claude translation

But if he tries to cut the examination short by asking questions, it is clear that he does not even want to listen. But if he chooses to answer, first of all we must ask him to what thing he applies the name “animal”; and when he has answered this, we must ask again what “what is conceived” or “what is in the womb” signifies to him: whether by “what is in the womb” he means also the things not yet formed and the seed itself that has been deposited, or only what is already articulated and formed, the so-called embryos. When he has answered this too, one must then conclude and teach the matter at hand in order. But if he wants us to speak without answering himself, let him hear: “Since you are unwilling to say of what signified thing you are speaking in what you proposed (for then I would not be arguing about meanings but would already be examining the things themselves), know that you have done something like this: as if you had proposed whether the dog is an animal. For I might reasonably say, ‘What sort of dog?’ For I will go through the land dog and the sea dog and the star in the heavens, and also Diogenes and the other dogs in turn. For I could not divine whether you are asking about all or about one. What you will do later, then, do now: say clearly which one you are inquiring about. But if you are twisting about names, then the very name ‘what is conceived’ is plainly, to everyone, neither an animal nor a plant, but a name and a sound and a body and a being and a something, and anything rather than an animal. And if this is what you proposed, you have your answer.”

About this passage

Source
Stählin 2 · Otto Stählin, ed., Clemens Alexandrinus, vol. 2, Stromata Buch I–VI, GCS 15 (Leipzig: Hinrichs, 1906); vol. 3, Stromata Buch VII und VIII, GCS 17 (Leipzig: Hinrichs, 1909) · Greek text: Otto Stählin, Clemens Alexandrinus 2–3 (GCS 15, 17, 1906–1909), digitized by the Perseus Digital Library, CC BY-SA 4.0
Text
As printed in Stählin, GCS 15, 17. Manuscript variants and the editor's apparatus are not reproduced; the problem in this passage is discussed in the notes.
Translation
Claude translation (claude-opus-5-5), 2026-09-27 · Translated by Claude from the Greek text of Stählin (1906–1909); made independently of existing English translations.
Compare
Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 2 (1885) (an older public-domain English translation, whole volume at CCEL; checked against ours only after ours was made) · Book 3 is left partly untranslated (in Latin) there.

Notes

Translation notes

  • The “dogs” are the land dog, the sea dog (dogfish), the Dog Star (Sirius), and Diogenes and the other Cynic philosophers, who were called “dogs.” Stählin brackets the words “and the animals” after “not yet formed” as spurious, and the digital text marks a supplied word before “deposited” with an unpaired angle bracket.

Notes on the original text

  • Digital text corrected (stray bracket from the editor's supplement (the supplied word is kept)): αὐτὸ τὸ> καταβεβλημένον → αὐτὸ τὸ καταβεβλημένον.

Cite this passage

Clement of Alexandria, Strom. 8.4.12 (trans. Sophia Scriptura, https://sophiascriptura.com/fathers/clement-stromata/8/4/12/).

Plain text
Clement of Alexandria, Strom. 8.4.12 (trans. Sophia Scriptura, https://sophiascriptura.com/fathers/clement-stromata/8/4/12/).

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